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Forum Stowarzyszenia MyCork  |  Cork  |  English Corner  |  Wątek: Learning Polish - Mowie tylko troche po polsku! 0 użytkowników i 1 Gość przeglądają ten wątek. « poprzedni następny »
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Autor Wątek: Learning Polish - Mowie tylko troche po polsku!  (Przeczytany 5688 razy)
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« : 22 August 2006, 18:05:49 »

Just wondering if any locals are learning Polish?

I've been learning the odd bit here and there for the last few weeks. I even got a CD and a book for the laugh in Waterstones and I'm really enjoying it. The first day I saw the book in Easons there were 5 copies and when I returned they were all gone so there must be some people out there like me.

A few things I've learned about the language:

Its not very easy but at the same time its not impossible (like Hungarian). Being slavic its very different to french, german, spanish and italian. I speak reasonably good French and a bit of German but they're of no use learning Polish.

I've learned some Estonian which is easy and reads like English but pronouncing Polish is difficult when you're starting off. You have to have an audio reference when learning words, unlike, Spanish, German or Italian where guess work will get you very close to the proper pronounciation.

Like our Irish, Polish also has something all English speakers hate when learning a foreign language: gender based nouns - all of which have different forms in different cases and whose adjectives have to agree with the endings too. Its a minefield.

All verb forms conjugate - so you have to learn each one individually unlike English where knowing the root will get you the whole verb by just adding 's' in the third person singular (he/she/it).

E.G. 'to give' = I give, he gives, he will give, they give.  


On the upside:
Anytime I've tried a Polish word or sentence on a Pole they've nearly always understood what I've said even though my pronounciation has been dodgy.

This is unlike, for example, in French when you have to be spot on with the accent or else Jacques the waiter will make silly gestures of incomprehension making you feel silly and you'll end up with a plate of goat's cheese instead of the steak you thought you were ordering.

They don't have articles 'a' and 'the' so that's why you hear people from Eastern Europe who speak slavic languages leave them out all the time. 'I go to cinema'. This small concession in complexity spares you further trauma.  

Irish is probably my best language after English and there are a lot of similarities in the way Polish and Irish sentences are constructed so the concepts aren't wildly different with the endings on words changing:

moj brat - my brother
dom mojego brata - the house of my brother

In Irish the start of the word can change too so at least with Polish you can focus on the beginning of the word and try to work it out from that.

Polish IMHO is very different to most western European languages so learning it is a challenge but much more rewarding. I saw an ad in Polish today in Dunnes and knew a few words on it...which was nice.

I've no intention of trying to become fluent but its nice to know a bit about the language and have a few words and sentences without getting too bogged down in the grammar or spellings.

If anyone's interested this is a pretty good website with some free software:
http://www.byki.com

The book and CD I got in Waterstones is called 'teach yourself Polish'.

Do widzenia.
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« Odpowiedz #1 : 23 August 2006, 14:31:10 »

That's really nice, keep going. A lot of polish people, including me, will appreciate this, it's not so usual for Irish to learn polish, as it's not as usefull as Spanish or French (or even German)
Your observations about Polish and Irish are very relevant - they are very difficult languages, with complicated grammar and spelling. I know that some of my friends are trying to learn a little bit of Irish despite any difficulties.
Also I know few Irish and one American learning Polish. I believe there are also Polish courses organised for gov workers.
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jeszcze jeden post i będę nadguru! jupi


« Odpowiedz #2 : 25 August 2006, 19:00:52 »

And I've been told that some Irish employers wanted their employees to learn Polish. They were gonna buy 'em some books and dictionaries as well
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Be aware of what you are about to post below my reply as I'm being Guru, having connection with administration and there's only one post left before my range gets upgraded!!!
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« Odpowiedz #3 : 27 August 2006, 12:08:40 »

I know two Irish who are learning Polish, but not intentionaly from books, CDs or something like this. They do it when at work, cause they work with always changing contractors from Poland. Those workes usually don't know English at all, so some words in Polish can change atmosphere at once, you know.

Of course this training is based on the worst pieces of bad Polish, and then simple words and sentences generally concerned on work. Irish are very happy when they can pronoun something properly, and when a Pole understands them.  Very Happy Mayby because the Polish appreciate those who wanted to learn Polish are happy too?

I'm learning Irish from byki.com free version with no intention of any level of fluency (yet! Cool ) And what I have noticed: Irish is much more easy to pronoun when you are Pole in comparison to situation when you are Irish but your native language is English! Polish and Irish have many simillarities in SOUND. Unlike English and Irish or English and Polish.

I love the sound of Irish. This sound reaches deep into my soul and gives me desire to learn this beautiful language.

Is mise Janusz.
Uisce Beatha I Nie Ma Stracha!

Slan.

Pozdro   Cool
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« Odpowiedz #4 : 31 August 2006, 10:04:57 »

Hi Cartoon,
You might want to take a look here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_language#Phonology
Very comprehensive explanation. Might be usefull if you are interested in details.
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« Odpowiedz #5 : 03 September 2006, 13:06:01 »

Cytuj z: "zen"
Hi Cartoon,
You might want to take a look here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_language#Phonology
Very comprehensive explanation. Might be usefull if you are interested in details.


If you are Irish don't be affraid. This wikipedia article is true, but normal Pole doesn't know these rules, although rules have been imprinted to us at schools for many years when we were learning "Polish language". I've forgotten rules but of course I speak and write fluent Polish  Very Happy Only bloody teachers know them completly. Smile
Some theory is a must, but speaking with natives is necesary. There is no other solution, belive me. Cause our language is completly "spy free" - complicated to such degree that there is no possibility to learn Polish to play Pole if you haven't been raised in Poland. And starting with "rules" will only discourage you. Razz

Pozdro   Cool
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« Odpowiedz #6 : 01 October 2006, 17:29:03 »

There was no response for many weeks.

There's no need to hide and run Irish People. I know that You were hidding thou's ability to use Gaelick for centuries. But bad times can be considered as finished I think.

I know only one Irish, who talks openly "Yes, I know Irish". Rest of You were always talking "I know only 2-3 words in Irish". Obviously it was a lie, as I've found later...

Yes I understand, there was English occupation for about one thousand years...


ps. We were dying in thousands in attempt to save our language. We've won !!!

Greetings  from Poland   Cool
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« Odpowiedz #7 : 19 October 2006, 17:48:03 »

Hi Thozo,

That's great your learning some Irish. You're correct. We learn it for 13-14 years at school from age 5 until 18. Most people have learned lots of Irish but because we don't use it regularly lots of people forget words.

Personally I find some of the Irish spoken on the Irish TV station TG4 very difficult to understand sometimes especially if the people talking are from the North of the country.

They have lots of different words and speak with very different accents. I have discussed this with Polish people and while you do have differences in Polish accents, here in Ireland we can nearly tell somebody's address from their accent!

Since so many foreigners have been coming to Ireland, Irish people now appreciate having their own language a bit more. For example UCC have classes and there is a 3 year waiting list! Its only 2.50 euro for 2 hours once a week.

bkyi is a great way to learn phrases. I have learned lots of Polish from the free version. The problem is that I don't really practice it that much.

Do widzenia.
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« Odpowiedz #8 : 07 November 2006, 19:55:13 »

Hey Cartoon!!!

There could be only one reply:



Thank YOU for beeing Irish, for personal reasons also.

I've got a warning about this (l.a.n.g.e.r) t-shirt from female site admin. Can you imagine? Oh women.... They want, but sometimes are affraid  Wink

Pozdro   Cool
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« Odpowiedz #9 : 07 November 2006, 20:52:40 »

Nie jestem langer.

That's the best I can do.

Today's Polish tongue twister is "wszystko w porzadku".
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« Odpowiedz #10 : 08 November 2006, 08:43:44 »

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Nie jestem langer.

That's the best I can do.

Today's Polish tongue twister is "wszystko w porzadku".


But I'am

You are much better in Polish than I'am in Irish I think. I must learn.

Pozdro   Cool

Added after 9 hours 52 minutes:

 
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Hi Thozo,

That's great your learning some Irish. You're correct. We learn it for 13-14 years at school from age 5 until 18. Most people have learned lots of Irish but because we don't use it regularly lots of people forget words.

Personally I find some of the Irish spoken on the Irish TV station TG4 very difficult to understand sometimes especially if the people talking are from the North of the country.

They have lots of different words and speak with very different accents. I have discussed this with Polish people and while you do have differences in Polish accents, here in Ireland we can nearly tell somebody's address from their accent!

Since so many foreigners have been coming to Ireland, Irish people now appreciate having their own language a bit more. For example UCC have classes and there is a 3 year waiting list! Its only 2.50 euro for 2 hours once a week.

bkyi is a great way to learn phrases. I have learned lots of Polish from the free version. The problem is that I don't really practice it that much.

Do widzenia.


Hey Cartoon!

Yes Polish is almost the same in every corner of our country. I think that this situation is made by TV, comunism and education system after WWII.

Of course there is possibility of discerning regions by ear. For example I live in Zgorzelec, we speak fast and with power. We are laughing when somebody is using Warsaw style Very Happy. There are of course many other colors in this rainbow so to speak. But no problem with understanding each other.

I've invented new togue twister for you at the moment:
"Wrocław lśni czystością."

Yes I know how hard it is so don't despair.

Greetings   Cool

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« Odpowiedz #11 : 08 November 2006, 10:41:32 »

Cytuj


I've invented new togue twister for you at the moment:
"Wrocław lśni czystością."

Yes I know how hard it is so don't despair.

Greetings   Cool

Thozo


I can do the first word as I've heard a few Polish people say the name of the city. The second bit is ok (for Polish this is a short word!). The third one I sound like a drunk.
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« Odpowiedz #12 : 08 November 2006, 15:41:38 »

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Cytuj


I've invented new togue twister for you at the moment:
"Wrocław lśni czystością."

Yes I know how hard it is so don't despair.

Greetings   Cool

Thozo


I can do the first word as I've heard a few Polish people say the name of the city. The second bit is ok (for Polish this is a short word!). The third one I sound like a drunk.


My Irish friend had big problem with Wrocław, so you must be good. You know English, Irish, French so learning new pronounciation must be your bloody habit Very Happy

I want to hear it. Could you record "Wrocław lśni czystością" or more if you want (I do Very Happy ) and send me through email? (thozo   then  @wp.pl) I'm very interested.

ps. Nie jestem langer, simply I had bad thoughts about myself yesterday. By the way how I could if I was born in Zgorzelec not in Cork Very Happy "Home grown Zgorzelec langer" sounds stupid.

Pozdro   Cool
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« Odpowiedz #13 : 28 January 2007, 11:44:51 »

Hi... I know there's EVENING COURSE IN BEGINNERS POLISH at UCC but i heard that recruitment is already finished. Maybe I'm wrong. TEL. O-21 4902335
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« Odpowiedz #14 : 08 February 2007, 00:14:19 »

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complicated to such degree that there is no possibility to learn Polish to play Pole if you haven't been raised in Poland. And starting with "rules" will only discourage you. Razz


Hej Thozo

Au contraire, to use a French expression! There is one other possibility, and that is to be born into a Polish family who have emigrated for one reason or another. Think of the present & future generations of Polish in Cork, as an example.

And this is my own situation too, and probably unique in Cork at this time. I have Polish blood and roots but was born and raised in London, UK. I observed Polish traditions, went to cubs, then scouts [zuchy/harcerstwo], went to Polish church on Sunday, enjoyed a lively Polish social scene and attended a Saturday Polish school every week from a small kid until 16, and flew through the official exam (Oxford Examination Board) for Polish language & grammar at 15 ('O' Level, czyli mala matura). Never been a big reader so got thrown out of the literature class (Trylogia anyone? PT?) Razz

Where does that put me? It's an identity crisis on a daily basis as I'm bilingual in English and Polish, was brought up with Polish traditions in English cultural surroundings. Internally - my soul or 'gut feel' or whatever - I'm Polish without a doubt. My thinking language is English and I've often said to myself that its because I'm lazy.  Shocked  Very Happy

My grasp of the language is receptively very good and I'll understand 98% of what anyone says - the 2% being the slang that I missed out on or words I wouldn't usually come across - as well as any really chronic dialect lol (is that 3%?). Projectively, i.e. spoken, it's a different story as it's true to say 'use it or lose it'. Having instant access to the range of vocabulary to vocalise or detail what I want to say isn't that easy! Since the age of 16 my speaking skills started waning with my decline from contact with the community that helped me to learn and nurture these vitamins. Also, I won't necessarily know anglicised words in common use but of course will understand others using them. And of course my accent is heavily English! My main language set is from my teachers and parents/grandparents - kinda old. It's an embarrassing learning curve for me at times, as I feel that I 'ought to' be able to keep up.

What now? Think 15 or 20 years ahead in Cork: a Polish community growing with 'non-native natives', a bi-lingual youth that gets a thick ear from their parents to speak Polish, brought up in the prevailing cultural surroundings, in (hopefully) a Polish environment. There must be some continuity. These youngsters will find themselves in a difficult situation, to decide for themselves who they are and come to terms with it. BUT: they'll have the advantage of learning this beautiful language in a way quite unlike anyone else.

A Polish firend once remarked that I have gained a language 'for free'. It's true. But there is so much more, of course, than just a language.

Personally speaking it's great to see a Polish community thriving in Cork.  Wink

Niektorzy z was znacie mnie na pewno, i ja was! 'Niestety' jestem jedyny, a was wielu  lol

S
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« Odpowiedz #15 : 07 April 2007, 12:29:26 »

Hey, did anyone hear anymore abnout this polish classes in UCC? i cannot find any information about it at all!

Also, anyone interested (and able) to teach polish?
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« Odpowiedz #16 : 08 April 2007, 18:22:56 »

Did you try to call on the number which I posted?
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« Odpowiedz #17 : 08 April 2007, 18:48:19 »

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Did you try to call on the number which I posted?


honestly, no, i will do so tuesday so. Very Happy and let you know
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« Odpowiedz #18 : 11 April 2007, 02:41:27 »

Hope you'll find this_site handy. I did ]:>
Keep up the good work!
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yes I'd have to say I like my privacy
and did you know you're on closed circuit TV? so smile at me...
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« Odpowiedz #19 : 24 April 2007, 19:00:22 »

Let us know how you get on with that number doleary.

Ive been doing a little bit of Polish from the book I got every now and then and Im still enjoying it. However, I find as I learn more and try to make sentences that the grammar is causing me trouble (read: is boring me!)

Learning seven different versions of one noun is a bit tedious for English speakers not used taking the genitive case into account etc. You dont get this in French, German or Spanish either although we have it in Irish but not as much. For some reason you have to make all the word endings agree - must have been the Warsaw Pact. I'd like to meet the person who decided that rule!

Its impossible to learn properly from a book or without a teacher/native speaker because you dont know what pronounciation mistakes your making. Im going to have to address this at some stage even though DJ Marekky has been helped me a few times.

Thats why I have been very slow - because I want to be able to read the words first and learn what they mean later. From the book Ive learned some weird phrases though that tend to surprise Polish people.

For example I dont know how to ask somebody what their name is, where they live or how old they are or other basic things BUT I can say:

"It seems you will be very busy all day" and "excuse me Sir, smoking is strictly forbidden here"

I can also direct you to the Royal Palace in Warsaw...but only if you are standing on a particular street.  I also can arrange to meet you in Polish but only at the market and only at six o'clock.

Sadly, this amuses me and will continue.
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« Odpowiedz #20 : 24 April 2007, 20:21:38 »

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Let us know how you get on with that number doleary.


i called it and they told me to call them back, there are NO plans BUT Plans to see IF they will do it again

will keep you informed Smile
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« Odpowiedz #21 : 19 May 2007, 09:42:25 »

Hey all, they are hoping to run a two week intensive Polish course in UCC this summer (June 2007).

It will depend on numbers, Call Aisling O'Leary in the Italian Department about it 4902335

Cost €100 for UCC Students & Staff and €120 for external applicants.
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« Odpowiedz #22 : 26 May 2007, 21:09:44 »

I'd like to meet the person who decided that rule!

I`d like to meet that person as well Smile

Polish language is little bit difficult even 4 polish people!
But i hope u going well Smile

If any question I am here... Wink
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